Iran/Cuba: Polar Opposites
Where Val pisses a bunch of people off, once again.
Lots of folks commenting on the Iran election protests, mostly equating the situation with the government there to that of Cuba. And for the most part, I agree that both the Iranian and Cuban governments are cut of the same mold. Unfortunately, the similarities pretty much end there.
The best coverage on the Iran protest by far has been at Jim Hoft's Gateway Pundit. Just click and scroll down and you will see the absolute brutality or the Iranian government against it's people.
What you see in the pictures posted there and elsewhere isn't just a government run amok, brutalizing its people without prejudice. What you see are a people risking it all for what they truly believe. Risking it all for themselves and their families and their fellow countrymen.
There have never been, aren't now and will most likely never be anti-castro protests of that magnitude in Cuba.
"There have never been, aren't now and will most likely never be anti-castro protests of that magnitude in Cuba. "
How sad but true. This is the ONLY thing that will ever guarantee freedom for Cubans. Until they are ready to do so they can just sit back and take it.
Val, I am somewhat pissed off. But not at you. I am sad and pissed off because what you are saying, is the harsh truth.
Despite the fact that I still to keep some hope, I posted a while ago about it. Trust me; it is heartbreaking to see what the Cuban people have ended up being. Jeez, it is so hard to explain with words!
And again, only when you have left is that you become able to see it. Honestly, I need to put in writing a truckload of thoughts to see if this picture makes any sense.
I have the exact words to describe it in Spanish, but it is harder for me to do it in English. I will, eventually, put it in writing. It needs to be said, even though is could pissed off a lot of people. Only being there one can understand.
Makes the small group of dissidents on the island look even braver by virtue of the silence of their fellow countrymen.
Asi mismo es, George. And you know what is even harder to see? That all those dissident we check on daily here are almost unknown for the mainstram, average Joe Cuban.
People just don't care, and I mean regular normal people that are also up to their noses with the regimen.
The combination of the effective propaganda of the regimen linking them to the evil empire and the CIA and the censorship that does not allow you to draw your own conclusions, the true fact that their families have to survive on foreign contributions, the internal figths for the spotlight and to be seen as the group holding the last truth that - sadly by real - many dissidents in Cuba engage on, and the recent scandals that demonstrate how many people outside Cuba are living like Rockefeller under the cover of an organization aiding the dissidence in Cuba have taken a huge toll in the credibility of this llaneros solitarios figther within their own countrymen.
They just want to escape and nobody cares about anything else. Someone to keep the Morro lighthouse? No way!
Then you have young people with blogs and sneaking through the internet censorship pulling out a whole different phenomenon... and some of the old school dissidents trying to discredit them, and it is an endless wheel of lack of union. Cuban idiosincracy? Perhaps is that...
There is no consensus, and between that and the apathy 50 years of repression have seed in our brains, thge dictarship has all the cards on the table for a sure victory.
Pototo:
If you had asked Filomeno
or read Cuban history you would have learned:
1) there were massive demonstrations against Castro far larger than in Iran, especially considering the disparity in population of the two countries
2) there was a war of resistance which the Castro government calls "The War Against Batista." This war was far bloodier and lasted far longer than the "War against Batista."
I appreciate the sentiment, considering the historical record.
But it is important to remember that we haven't seen in Cuba an event that might spark a similar uprising.
It is premature to judge the Cuban people, as long as Fidel Castro is alive. Let's see how they respond to his inevitable death.
Oyeme Val,
Ve parece que estas hablando un poco de m..
But I know you mean well.
Your aren't jealous of the Iranians are you?
As long as this guy is our President we are screwed though.
I ditto the last comment prior to mine.
Rich
Marc, that is, actually, the only thing that I see as a hope to cling to, after seeing what I saw. It was, in a nutshell, a very depressing experience. However, I personally, refuse to capitulate and quit thinking about the posibility of having the island going back to normalcy.
An old man living there, who initially trusted the revolution and later learned the hard way about betrayal, recently told me that we have to see another 20 years of that decrepit regimen until changes start to come up, from within the same government.
Until all those "historicos" and die-hard communist die, they won't allow a single thing to change and whoever speaks up will be execute with the protection of the current laws, he said. After that, a Gorbachov-type will arise and then, little by little, thing will have a better chance to change, he added.
And, believe it or, there are a lot regular people who do believe that we - the ones anywhere outside Cuba - are indeed a mafia that wants to promote democracy and change just to make money out of it. A lot of people seems reluctant to any promotion of change that does not come from within... I don't know... honestly, it is very confusing..
Marc, I beg to differ. They had the perfect opportunity during el maleconazo in 1994 and squandered it.
Unfortunately immigration to the U.S. both illegal and legal acts as a pressure valve for Castro & co.
The masses of dissidents who would make up the Iran-like protest, are all living in Little Havana. From a Machiavellian stand point Fidel was "brilliant" to utilize the 20,000 per year visas to leave for his most ardent and credible critics on the island. Sadly I think if you held a "democratic" vote on the island, Raul would probably win with a majority. Imagine if San Francisco was able to remove all of their conservatives from the city every year for 50 years and then were able to remove or imprison every critic of their leftist government for 50 years. This is not a recipe for fostering a grass roots revolution. It is a recipe for a fortified and entrenched state that can't be toppled easily if ever.
The real pisser is these people that go back to Cuba to visit, I'm sorry but if you or your family lost everything to these thugs, what the hell are you doing going back? Didn't they take enough the first time?
To me the worst thing that every happened was the opening up by Jimmy Carter.
If those little trips back to Cuba would never had been allowed and Visas stopped we wouldn't be talking anymore about the dictatorship. You can't change the past but now we this crap with Obama opening it up again, the impression is that its open business for Americans, I can't tell how many people ask me, oh aren't going to visit? My response is F No!, nothing has changed for me to go back!!
Unfortunately, the previous commenter is right on that; it does affect the genuine cause for a chage towards democracy in Cuba. Many people do - rightfully - question how bad things are there when people are going back to vacation like if it was Cancun or bypassing the previous regulations to go as mulas. There is a huge business behind all that, and money is huge incentive in this case.
I meant to say "those cases".
Larry Daley
June 24th, 2009 at 6:03 PM
Pototo:
If you had asked Filomeno
or read Cuban history you would have learned:
1) there were massive demonstrations against Castro far larger than in Iran, especially considering the disparity in population of the two countries
2) there was a war of resistance which the Castro government calls "The War Against Batista." This war was far bloodier and lasted far longer than the "War against Batista."
===========
Larry,
I lived Cuban history. Don't need to ask Filomeno. I was born there.
Marc
June 24th, 2009 at 6:11 PM
I appreciate the sentiment, considering the historical record.
But it is important to remember that we haven't seen in Cuba an event that might spark a similar uprising.
It is premature to judge the Cuban people, as long as Fidel Castro is alive. Let's see how they respond to his inevitable death.
=============================
I agree completely. If that doesn't do it. Then NOTHING will.
Pototo:
Don't play that game unless you were:
... standing in the "Plaza Civica" with all the hundreds of thousands of Catholics, Protestants and Jew trying to resist the onslaught of communism ...
... jailed during the Bay of Pigs as were so many hundreds of thousands of Cuba perhaps a year later...
Well I was ...
Larry Daley (Garcia-I~niguez Enamorado Ramirez ...)